Time for BITD to MOVE UTV Start w/ ALL 4 Wheel Vehicles

[Co-Dawg 1915]

I wanted to post this a few days ago, but life has been hectic with work, kids, ect.. I spoke with Casey on the phone last week. He confirmed what I stated to be true. That Dondel was the one that hit us. I understand that things happen quickly in racing, and that sometimes mistakes are made. I know that Dale did not intentionally hit us. However this contact ultimately ended our race, and could have seriously injured or killed us. Which really pissed me off, and led me to say somethings that I regret. I would like to apologize for the name calling, and negative comments that I made towards Dale. While talking to Casey he informed me that at one point Dale followed a UTV for 5 miles. So I am sure that the impatience he showed us was a direct result of others in the UTV class not pulling over as soon as possible. As I stated before, we pulled over as soon as I saw him in the mirror, and I believe he just got back to the gas too soon. Casey also stated that there was a UTV that held up a TT for 9 miles. Why the hell would you want a TT on your ass for more than a few seconds. I might be a rookie (1 full year in the right seat), but I am not stupid, and consider myself to be one of the top co-drivers in the class.

 

[Kalop]

I wanted to post this a few days ago, but life has been hectic with work, kids, ect.. I spoke with Casey on the phone last week. He confirmed what I stated to be true. That Dondel was the one that hit us. I understand that things happen quickly in racing, and that sometimes mistakes are made. I know that Dale did not intentionally hit us. However this contact ultimately ended our race, and could have seriously injured or killed us. Which really pissed me off, and led me to say somethings that I regret. I would like to apologize for the name calling, and negative comments that I made towards Dale. While talking to Casey he informed me that at one point Dale followed a UTV for 5 miles. So I am sure that the impatience he showed us was a direct result of others in the UTV class not pulling over as soon as possible. As I stated before, we pulled over as soon as I saw him in the mirror, and I believe he just got back to the gas too soon. Casey also stated that there was a UTV that held up a TT for 9 miles. Why the hell would you want a TT on your ass for more than a few seconds. I might be a rookie (1 full year in the right seat), but I am not stupid, and consider myself to be one of the top co-drivers in the class.

5 miles....

9 miles...

Am I the only one thinking BULLSHIT ???

Do they have any way to prove this stuff on trackers or they just taking TT word for it.... cuz after seeing what the TT guys post on RDC I've quickly realized their over-run with a bunch classless group of shit-turds that would just as soon as nerf or wreck someone and laugh about it.

 

[Co-Dawg 1915]

5 miles....

9 miles...

Am I the only one thinking BULLSHIT ???

Do they have any way to prove this stuff on trackers or they just taking TT word for it.... cuz after seeing what the TT guys post on RDC I've quickly realized their over-run with a bunch classless group of shit-turds that would just as soon as nerf or wreck someone and laugh about it.

Those numbers came from Casey when I was talking to him on the phone.

 

[Kalop]

Those numbers came from Casey when I was talking to him on the phone.

I don't doubt you Mike. I don't doubt Casey that's what they told him. I just have hard time believing UTV (at 45mph or whatever) is going to hold the line while TT on their ass for 5-9 miles.

 

[crazywatson]

He still should have manned up and told the truth. What ever the case may be rules are rules and he should have been dq'ed I know I'm not a racer but I'm a supporting fan.

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[az_amsoil]

The RDC guys are pissed cause nobody likes having sh!t rubbed in their face. Sometimes you have to be a steward of your class and not an arrogant prick...I'm such a fan of this class but a couple guys keyboard strokes are giving all of you a bad rap. Sad but true.

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[az_amsoil]

There really needs to be a "rules of the race" for this class, some guys are oblivious to the obvious

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[Brian B]

The RDC guys are pissed cause nobody likes having sh!t rubbed in their face. Sometimes you have to be a steward of your class and not an arrogant prick...I'm such a fan of this class but a couple guys keyboard strokes are giving all of you a bad rap. Sad but true.

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Copy/paste? I sorta refuse to go on that site

 

[Steve (CTF)]

Just want to say I've been around TT and 1car teams for 14 years. And I raced UTV's from 2010-13. And I think starting 3hrs in front of them and only having to worry about 2 dozen cars running me down is safer then 200 or so of the rest of the field grinding on us to. Cause a 10 car heavy metal truck 16 cars 7 trucks jeep speeds will put you in the weeds just as we'll. so the thought of starting with the big show might not be a great idea.

 

[az_amsoil]

Copy/paste? I sorta refuse to go on that site

It's really the boasting about how fast/where UTVs "should" place. I understand the pride you guys have , but you also have to realize that all classes love there particular class. Some of these classes cross generations in families and having a couple guys mouthing off about how good/fast they are, in something that is still pretty new, comes off as arrogant. IMO the class 11 guys are the hero's and they won't beat anyone!

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[Ignore Amos]

5 miles....

9 miles...

Am I the only one thinking BULLSHIT ???

Do they have any way to prove this stuff on trackers or they just taking TT word for it.... cuz after seeing what the TT guys post on RDC I've quickly realized their over-run with a bunch classless group of shit-turds that would just as soon as nerf or wreck someone and laugh about it.

Im thinking pure BS on that one..I have been racing BITD in UTV's since 2011 (and bikes years before that) and I cant see a TT that would sit behind a UTV for more than a few seconds much less a 1/4 of a mile..they have the power and suspension to pass ANYWHERE they choose..and I cant think of a place in V2R that they couldn't pass whenever they wanted to... 5 mile...9 miles...thats actually really funny anybody would even suggest that...I can tell you that when TT comes up on you the just flat pass you period (and yes I did get nerf'd by a class one once...) it was no bueno.

 

[the stripping shop]

5/9 miles might be pushing it but when your racing 1min might fell like miles and miles. But I will tell you class 1 got stuck behind a utv really thick dust mixed with tight section cant see until your right on them. Now some unlimited guys may drive with gps at this point or wait for better section to pass clean but when your racing patience is not your friend. Some guys got passed clean some didn't. The real issue is safety and time. Quads and dirt bikes will still be caught with the time he allows. Will it be funner to be with car and trucks yes but you will not finish during the day now and we will hear about more utv punted out of the way more often or tangled with other vehicle. But at least you won't hear the class gods bitching at you any more.

 

[crazywatson]

My uncle use to race a class 9 car and he told me as a kid every time Ivan Stewert passed him he never knew he was coming. He said he was the smoothest driver he's ever seen and always made a smooth clean pass. These guys need to learn some fineness like ol Ivan.

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[warlock]

Im thinking pure BS on that one..I have been racing BITD in UTV's since 2011 (and bikes years before that) and I cant see a TT that would sit behind a UTV for more than a few seconds much less a 1/4 of a mile..they have the power and suspension to pass ANYWHERE they choose..and I cant think of a place in V2R that they couldn't pass whenever they wanted to... 5 mile...9 miles...thats actually really funny anybody would even suggest that...I can tell you that when TT comes up on you the just flat pass you period (and yes I did get nerf'd by a class one once...) it was no bueno.

Yeah u would say more like 5 to 9 seconds. Lol.

 

[jaggedx]

The debate rages on! We have been racing UTV's since the inception of the class and the "Big Boys" have never liked it. Probably never will. Do I think that a TT driver would hit a UTV on purpose? Yup! Not all of them... but some of them. Do I think they laugh about it later? Yup. Don't know if they would still laugh if someone got seriously hurt or killed? Don't want to find out either. Do I think the TT drivers drive blind in the dust? Yup, Pretty much every one of them. I don't think it's safe but unfortunately it is a real hazard in desert racing with or without a GPS and not in just the TT class. a slow UTV could get hit by a 10 car or a 4400 buggy too. A fast UTV could hit a slow 1600 car with similar results. If you drive in dust and can't see at some point you are going to hit some one or something.

Solution: Be in control of your vehicle! I know, Easier said than done, It is hard to control the adrenaline valve and racing = going as fast as you can.
If you are an unlimited racer, Please be respectful of the slower classes that you encounter and don't kill anyone. And don't be just a DICK either.
If you are a UTV racer or quad racer or whatever- Use your head, watch your mirrors, You know they are coming, Get the hell out of their way. I know most do but I also know that some do not act as quickly as they should. So here also Don't be a DICK either.


That being said, I think that the majority of the UTV class will be fine starting wherever BITD decides. The class as a whole are some of the most passionate racers I have ever seen and they will compete in whatever arena they are dealt.

in the beginning of UTV racing we started in the back of everyone! The finish rate was terrible and it was hard to even stay ahead of pit closings. The UTV has evolved since then, The average speeds have more than doubled. I remember trying to maintain an average of 24 MPH over 300 miles. our speeds now are closing in on 50mph. Most of the classes that we started behind then have NOT evolved at all. Jeepspeeds average has not changed over the years, 1600 cars have not changed much over the years. Clearly the UTVs are faster than they were back then and they should start in a logical position based on average speeds. probably right behind the 1600 cars.
For those who think starting in in the 4 wheel classes is "more" dangerous I can only say this, Last year we started racing SCORE where UTV's start last. We have not seen any conflict with larger classes.

Lets go racing and keep growing this great class.

BS JX

 

[goMRgo]

Well said Bill! Let's just race and be smart about it.

 

[Blue Coyote]

Saw this idea posted some where but not talked about much:
Add a switchable rear amber light - so the co-dog can flash the rear amber, letting the chasing vehicle know that the lead vehicle is aware of them, and will be pulling over as soon as safely possible.


www.NorthwestOffroad.net

 

[Kalop]

Seems to me that you should have complete rear light system KILL switch, flip switch and pull off road as far as you can ?? Can't follow the lights off the track if they're not there.

I guess you could argue that if your sitting in cloud of dust with no lights (even off the track) your asking to get smashed too... damned if you do damned if you don't may be the case.

 

[danishracer]

I am so new here I maybe shouldn't post, I road raced motorcycles for years and when we enduranced raced and were on a big bike at say Daytona it was scary blowing by a smaller bike that was 60MPH slower, and you could see them! as I am getting into a UTV Polaris for my first race I'm starting to think this may be a lil out of control! I attended my first ever Desert race, it was the V2R race and helped in the chase vehicle so I only seen pit road speeds and the dust, after reading every post on here I have a new outlook on it, but seriously driving through that dust blind using only GPS!!! you have to be kidding again I am so new to this I should maybe keep my mouth shut but am wondering, why don't they start the trucks first? then gradually down to the slowest class? again don't beat me up over my question but it seems like the TT's start last and finishing first and are getting there anyway they can.

 

[badassmav]

ok....trying to understand the situation. Like I posted, the only disadvantage to starting last is that the track is seriously chewed up.

At Blue Water, the TT's run in the afternoon, and UTV's, etc. run in the AM.

I really think that Casey is thinking about the condition of the track.

So there saying that a few Hrs more of there time is not worth the Life it may save. If it was there Family or Friend who Dies in a Race cause the UTV got Balled up by a 100+ Mph Tank They would think differently about a few extra hrs that would have changed so many lives for a Lifetime.

Back to the original request (demand) that UTV's start with the 4 wheel classes

Please do not take this as an opinion to not make the change I just want everyone to know what it means overall. Go in with eyes wide open.

As was said before the track will be much rougher after all of those 37 and 39+ tires do a job on the track. Bigger holes, deeper silt, markings and banners gone and the ruts are far worse and 91 inches wide. Driving in those wide ruts sucks after a while. But on the other hand this is desert racing we want it rough.

Finishing rates will be down due to the track conditions and now you will have to deal with pit closing times. When the UTVs used to start in the back of the cars and trucks they calculated pit closing times with a 25 to 30 mph average and back then the UTVs averaged 30 mph. It was a constant fight with pit closures. Granted UTVs are much faster now but say goodbye to being able to fix major problems there just isn't time.

Average speeds will slow down due to the track, dust and traffic

Getting space at the pit stops when traveling with the main circus is a pain and if you are far enough behind for that not to be a problem your chase truck better be 4x4 cause the pits get torn up too.

Starting late puts you in the heat of the day at the lower elevations and makes sure you will be racing well into the night. The media and fans will have already gone to the after party.

And the part that bothers me most is you will have a lot more exposure to other 4 wheel classes with dust and much more traffic. It does not take a trophy truck to take you out - just about any class can and when a TT or class 1 breaks and then goes batshit crazy to catch back up you are in the same position you are in now.

With all that being said -if this change would save just 1 life I am all for it but I do not think it is as black and white as it appears.

Tim

I'm just guessing here, but if the UTE's started with the four wheel vehicles, they would be finishing after midnight, therefore, requiring the pemit in which BITD races under be extended for another day perhaps, and most likely, at substantial additional costs. If the latest cutoff time for the race is midnight Friday or earlier, well then, there's your answer. It would be a shame if that is the case(y), because it would be indicative that BITD profits are taking priority over the safety of the participants. There is a reason why the starting order is as it is, even though a majority vote of the two or three classes adversely affected by the starting order would show that most are against it. That's my 100,000 pennies!